tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post1774803834736588388..comments2023-05-19T03:47:28.621-07:00Comments on BoholAnalysis: What is the Church's Business in the Dauis Renaissance Program?Miko Cañareshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07724792963709441793noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-16646214284870066632013-10-02T19:40:15.226-07:002013-10-02T19:40:15.226-07:00Thanks Pinoyborian. Actually a colleague and I wan...Thanks Pinoyborian. Actually a colleague and I wanted to do this, but then we are facing a blank wall. But will try. Let's see how we can go about this. :)<br />Miko Cañareshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07724792963709441793noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-62107606175738689032013-09-30T03:51:32.779-07:002013-09-30T03:51:32.779-07:00Miko, I wonder if you are able to look back into t...Miko, I wonder if you are able to look back into this contract four years on? I prefer to know the actual benefits the good people of Dauis get out of this project. It's not enough for me to see the place transformed into a thing of beauty. It's good for the tourist's eyes and experience, it's good for the people of Dauis in terms of pride of place. But economically, did this project really fill in the stomachs of the real beneficiaries? If so, up to what extent? I meant of course, the people of Dauis, not the priest/Bishop nor the local officials.<br /><br />Thanks for the critical analysis on Bohol's development programs. I prefer that anytime over some local officials 'praise' releases from their in-house PR team. Padajon sa imong maajong buhat!Pinoyborianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01148736566392751346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-68777860489972428772012-10-12T00:10:56.191-07:002012-10-12T00:10:56.191-07:00Sorry for this late blog. Haven't seen this s...Sorry for this late blog. Haven't seen this site before today.<br /><br />I'm from Dauis and I saw when I went home how the convent was transformed, for the better of course. What I did not like was how the people working at the church commercialized the water from the "well inside the church." Selling it to tourists and townspeople alike. <br /><br />I have not read thoroughly your analysis, Mikko. But if what I have seen was part of the activities of the company, I think it should be stopped. That water, according to history, has quenched the thirst of many people, sans payment. It should continue as such.<br /><br />Besides, even during the time of Monsenor Descallar, the parishioners has always take care of the convent and the church. So, even without the generous loan or donation, or whatever from Ms. Zobel, I think whoever priest will be assigned there will not starve.<br /><br />Lastly, thank you Mikko for the eye opener. True, change is good. However, when it is done with less than pure intent, it can hurt a number of people. <br /><br /> <br /><br /> Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-88248683145804057192010-11-28T10:06:25.343-08:002010-11-28T10:06:25.343-08:00My cousin recommended this blog and she was totall...My cousin recommended this blog and she was totally right keep up the fantastic work!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-83933319013494715212009-05-03T18:49:00.000-07:002009-05-03T18:49:00.000-07:00Anonymous - A few million pesos would hardly cause...Anonymous - A few million pesos would hardly cause a dent in the vast reserves of the vatican.What if the convent will be lost.....let them have all the treasures.<br /><br />Miko - I do not mind to worship under fire trees. But I do mind when I worship under fire trees today because I did not say anything when somebody took the roof of the place where I used to worship yesterday.<br /><br />FAIR AND BALANCED..... Boholanos... it's your choice of who to follow....<br />I say, i'd go for Miko!!!!!Glennnavsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-84426991423929294382009-04-23T22:01:00.000-07:002009-04-23T22:01:00.000-07:00This is a response to the most recent comment.
I ...This is a response to the most recent comment.<br /><br />I should say that I am not in any way putting on a 'quarrel' over some 'property'. Also, I do not mind to worship under fire trees. But I do mind when I worship under fire trees today because I did not say anything when somebody took the roof of the place where I used to worship yesterday.<br /><br />True, salvation is not dependent on "physically solid priests's quarters". I did not make that argument, you did. If you think that to just say nothing about the cooperation agreement is a strategic option in dealing with the Dauis issue, then that is your choice. My task, to tell you the story, is done. Action now is in your hands.<br /><br />I did not make an inventory of the properties lost and in what you alleged as in the hands of 'favoured parishioners'. That is immaterial in the analysis. It would seem that you are sugggesting that just because properties were lost in the past or were in the hands of 'favoured parishioners', we just let the looting, assuming there is any, to go on.<br /><br />It saddens me to think that some people can go on living in indifference or apathy, and tell me that in the given circumstances, what is most appropriate is inaction.Miko Cañareshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07724792963709441793noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-53257915368058791282009-04-16T06:19:00.000-07:002009-04-16T06:19:00.000-07:00Loan or donation, don't really matter to people wh...Loan or donation, don't really matter to people who have started to feel food trickling in their once hungry stomachs.A few million pesos would hardly cause a dent in the vast reserves of the vatican.What if the convent will be lost? Has the author made an inventory of all church properties lost all these years? Or those in the hands of favored parishioners? Is salvation dependent on a physically solid priests' quarters?<br />If any of the parties have ill-will behind all these, let them have all the treasures;let us focus on saving our souls from eternal damnation! the priests can live in tents and we can worship under the fire trees because the Lord expects us to leave the way we have come, barenaked and penniless, leaving all what we quarreled for, behind!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-64038430226117782322009-04-16T06:18:00.000-07:002009-04-16T06:18:00.000-07:00Loan or donation, don't really matter to people wh...Loan or donation, don't really matter to people who have started to feel food trickling in their once hungry stomachs.A few million pesos would hardly cause a dent in the vast reserves of the vatican.What if the convent will be lost? Has the author made an inventory of all church properties lost all these years? Or those in the hands of favored parishioners? Is salvation dependent on a physically solid priests' quarters?<br />If any of the parties have ill-will behind all these, let them have all the treasures;let us focus on saving our souls from eternal damnation! the priests can live in tents and we can worship under the fire trees because the Lord expects us to leave the way we have come, barenaked and penniless, leaving all what we quarreled for, behind!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-37841021084814724242009-04-16T06:15:00.000-07:002009-04-16T06:15:00.000-07:00Loan or donation, don't really matter to people wh...Loan or donation, don't really matter to people who have started to feel food trickling in their once hungry stomachs.A few million pesos would hardly cause a dent in the vast reserves of the vatican.What if the convent will be lost? Has the author made an inventory of all church properties lost all these years? Or those in the hands of favored parishioners? Is salvation dependent on a physically solid priests' quarters?<br />If any of the parties have ill-will behind all these, let them have all the treasures;let us focus on saving our souls from eternal damnation! the priests can live in tents and we can worship under the fire trees because the Lord expects us to leave the way we have come, barenaked and penniless, leaving all what we quarreled for, behind!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-55610512472523064092009-04-14T07:36:00.000-07:002009-04-14T07:36:00.000-07:00wether its for business or not at least somebody m...wether its for business or not at least somebody moved by the spirits cared to develop. cross fingers they will not be striken by lighting when they sort out to greediness.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-20300988384661639782009-03-12T03:35:00.000-07:002009-03-12T03:35:00.000-07:00This comment is for Ms. Ramirez.There is not such ...This comment is for Ms. Ramirez.<BR/><BR/>There is not such thing as capitalism with a heart. That's romanticizing a word that is not at all an "affair of the heart", I should say.<BR/><BR/>If it was a donation, you might be right that the gesture is laudable, but it is constructively a loan. If you have read the full length of the paper and focused on the essential details of the cooperation agreement, then you should have known how biased the agreement is to the benefit of Bea. I do agree that the place was made beautiful, but that is not the essence of the argument. The essence of the argument is, much of what Bea spent on the "beautification" was never a donation. It was a loan, and the loan is couched on very unfavorable terms to the Church (and by Church here, I mean the people of Dauis, not the Bishop who signed the agreement. Vatican II teachings emphasizes that the Church is the people).<BR/><BR/>Read the analysis again, and you will realize that capitalism will never ever have a heart. Review your economics textbooks if you can find your treasured euphimism. <BR/><BR/>What is written in the cooperation agreement is persuasive. It rules over whatever sentimentality you have.Miko Cañareshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07724792963709441793noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-62568034354695654552009-03-11T17:59:00.000-07:002009-03-11T17:59:00.000-07:00"Capitalism with a heart" has anyone ever thought ..."Capitalism with a heart" has anyone ever thought of this? I think the parish of Dauis and my townmates are lucky enough to get the sympathy and benefit from the business clout of the Zobels.<BR/><BR/>If it takes a Bea Zobel with her financial capabilities to act and preserve the invaluable heritage of Dauis, it does not matter at all if she's an outsider, I welcome her involvement. I don't think Bea would invest time and money on a venture that is bound to fail. I am sure she is convinced this project can be both profitable and beneficial for all.<BR/><BR/>I am moved by Bea's attention to my dear parish, in which my tiny little steps echoed in its hallways many, many years back. I have seen how her project enhanced the beauty of this one magnificent Mariveles tree who has stood the passing of many years. To me it is a symbol of one woman who has imbibed the philosophy of "capitalism with a heart" and that makes a damn big difference!.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-26227960277346558062009-02-05T18:12:00.000-08:002009-02-05T18:12:00.000-08:00I will reply to the last comment on this post who ...I will reply to the last comment on this post who accused me that i barked on "something that fell short of reason and logic". First, he/she did not read the blog entry, or failed to understand it. He/she said that I "did not specify” in my “assessment if whether the said agreement included a valuation or prizing of the church”. He/she should read the blog entry again to know that we are not talking of the church as a building here. He/she must have been privy to these transactions that he/she was assuming that the church, as a building, is included in the analysis. To ask me what will Ms. Zobel do with the church is entirely misplaced because while my title refers to the social structure, he/she made comment on the physical structure. He/she should know that I was not talking about the church but the Dauis convent. I will also like to inform him/her that a thorough check on the matter can not be done because the “principals”, that’s what they call the ones spearheading the project, do not want to share their data. Even getting a copy of the agreement that was analyzed in the paper was all accidental. Also, until now, we are waiting for the “principals” to give us the business income projections. But I do understand his/her sympathies. These are those of people who jump to conclusion that a thing is good just because they heard it is. I advise him/her that before telling me to conduct a thorough check, he/she should also do his/her share before he/she tells me that I am unreasonable and illogical.Miko Cañareshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07724792963709441793noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-33110884290349293122009-02-04T11:02:00.000-08:002009-02-04T11:02:00.000-08:00I don't totally agree with what the author just sa...I don't totally agree with what the author just said in his analysis. To begin with, he did not specify in his assessment if whether the said agreement included a valuation or prizing of the church? Is the author trying to say that Ms. Zobel deliberately entered into a sort of "non-functional agreement" with the church so that for a period of time, when the church can't do its duty in the agreement, Ms. Zobel will take possession of the church? To begin with, what will Ms. Zobel intend do with the church? I think the author has to check first whats really the real thing about the project before he barks on something that fell short of reasons and logic. I think a thorough check on the matter would be more appreciated on the part of the author.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-6505964204406807872009-02-03T18:28:00.000-08:002009-02-03T18:28:00.000-08:00This is an exercise in futility. There is no such...This is an exercise in futility. There is no such thing as geniune altruism (though some contemporary economists contested this claim). I am deeply convinced that this is unorthodox method of invasion. One famous Chinese adage says " if you want to conquer the heart, feed the stomach because it can simply establish debt of gratitude"Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-46109370771791124382009-01-27T06:52:00.000-08:002009-01-27T06:52:00.000-08:00You have posed the right questions: who will stand...You have posed the right questions: who will stand to benefit and whose interest the program was conceived and implemented? <BR/><BR/>There is nothing intrinsically wrong if we want to generate funds from existing community assets like the colonial church in Dauis. I am an enthusiast of colonial churches and find joy every time I have a chance to visit one. I do not mind paying reasonable fees just to be given a chance to see and admire the history, culture and more importantly the architectural design of colonial churches. Sip coffee with freshly baked bread with the old convent as a backdrop or inside the convent. Watch sunset, sit around and read your favorite book. What could be more relaxing?<BR/><BR/>What makes it wrong is when a supposedly “community program” like this one becomes so general and lacks specificities beyond the concept of “good intentions” on the part of the organizer/s. Will it create enterprises in the community, thus provide opportunities for household to generate income as well and not only the church/enterpreneur? Is there going to be clear support from the organizers to prepare the community from the social upheavals that usually accompanies a tourism project? Will the community people be given special privileges and not subjected to the same rates/ruling that a “tourist or outsider” be subjected to. How public will the income be openly discussed and reported? Did the people agree to the components of the program like transforming their old convent into a coffee shop, function room, etc.<BR/><BR/>Therefore, my answer to the two questions posed is the major stakeholder, the community. The absence of a clear role of the community from conceptualization to implementation and the absence of articulated economic value (since this the only one that can be measured) to the locals, invalidates this program. Whether the business will make good or not -in the future-, the question of its validity will forever haunt the people who made it happen.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2138733156274516287.post-56377251614533056232009-01-26T18:27:00.000-08:002009-01-26T18:27:00.000-08:00Whether I am prodded out of sheer wonder or what n...Whether I am prodded out of sheer wonder or what not, I see some interesting points here... <BR/>One, it takes Bea, an outsider, to do the business of restoration and revival of a local religious and cultural heritage (apologies if I may have missed any fact of the often tedious consultation process that could have warranted legitimacy to such noble act.. in the first place, I wonder who should have a say here). I also can't pretend to not wonder whether this is pure altruism in the name of "saving" remnants of our, otherwise, colonial past or a personal 'panata'. And what say of the local officials? Are they strictly sticking to the 'separation of church & state' here? The Bohol Arts and Cultural Heritage Council/Code perhaps? <BR/>Two, speaking of "business", its no secret (not sure though if I got this somewhere in the Guinness Book of Records or from a liberation theologian) that the Catholic Church is the largest economic empire considering the vast amounts of assets, land primarily, they own... but it succinctly demonstrates that the Church is not in any way lagging behind in the modernity and market-driven project eh? Talking about renaissance and cultural revival with a little profit here and there (tourism?) would not have hurt, noh? For as long as there remain the good ol' souls of faithful parishioners to tend to, now this is a creative means for alternative livelihood and sustainability indeed. Rather than leave church property to rot in...total wreck. <BR/>Three, I acknowledge what must have been an emancipating urge to exercise agency of those representatives of the church to make use of such temporal properties but I just... pray that they do this with the true church's interest in mind... and yes, looking into the merits of this contract should be a stitch in time.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com